Now we are in trouble

2021-01-20 at 17:50

A teacher and a priest are the same thing. â€œWith classes three God filled the world; As best as best can be; One class must teach, another feed, The third â€™gainst wicked lads must strive.â€ (Erasmus Alberus, 16thc.) sauce: https://carlsbad1819.wordpress.com/2018/07/09/temptations-of-right-wing-socialism/

Ace

2021-01-20 at 19:48

I’m probably using the wrong dichotomy. I see Jim like Aristotle and Moldbug more like Plato. Moldbug/Plato created religious belief system along with telling truths. Jim/Aristotle created systems for understanding reality and created few if any new religious systems. That’s truth telling over religion building, which is sort of Ironic because Jim has been trying to restart a largely dead religion. It doesn’t work because religions are built on lies designed to create good outcomes and Jim doesn’t seem inclined to lie to us(Alf’s objections are noted).

Gestahlt

2021-01-20 at 18:22

Moldbug isn’t a priest. He is a tradesman (programmer) and scribe. Both are third varna, not first.

Post Author 2021-01-20 at 18:39

Moldbug is, or rather was, both a priest and engineer. Jesus was a priest and a carpenter. But Yarvin has chickened out of priesting since Moldbug became namefag Yarvin.

It is prophet time, and prophets have a short life expectancy.

We had a few paladins, warrior priests, but they have been purged from the military, and to the best of my knowledge, are not very good at priesting, because it is time for systems analysis, not war, and systems analysis is what engineers tend to be good at, and warriors poor at, except for Xenophon, who was a warrior economist.

Likely it will be time for war in five years or so.

alf

2021-01-20 at 20:03

Prophets have a short life expectancy? Well maybe Jesus, but all the ones in the ot seem to have lived until very old age, with many children. If we are prophets of Gnon, I think weâ€™d much prefer the latter kind of propheting.

Gary

2021-01-20 at 20:12

[*deleted for sacrilege and socinianism]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ky5l9ZxsG9M

Post Author 2021-01-21 at 00:54

Jonathan Clark, in “English Society 1688-1832: Ideology, Social Structure and Political Practice during the Ancien Regime” presents overwhelming evidence that it was Socinian entryists against Christianity that caused the fall of the Ancien regime in or around 1832.

Socinian entryists against Christianity are still at work, which dispute today manifests as the King James dispute, the dispute over the King James Bible versus some more recent, and more politically correct, bibles.

Somehow there is a striking correlation between a bible reading “marriageable age” into the Old Testament, reading Sacramental Marriage out of the New Testament, and reading the pre existence of Jesus Christ from before the beginning of the world out of the New Testament.

Somehow, all over the place, we see bibles that are not trinitarian. And when we see a bible that is not trinitarian, we see amazingly politically correct Hebrews in the Old Testament.

seshonald

2021-01-22 at 13:51

What is it about the trinity specifically that these demonic freaks hate so much?

Eumenes

2021-01-22 at 23:17

Hatred of the Trinity manifests itself in condescension. Those who hate God mock the theology of those who love God.

In the thread below on Stephen Colbertâ€™s video, Colbert compares the Trinity to a fidget spinner, and uses his analogy to mock Christians who point out that the analogy is heretical, more specifically Modalist.

The heretics view themselves as achieving virtue through knowledge. Socinians, Arians, Modalists, Gnostics and Universalists pride themselves through knowledge, not through repentance and prayer. Heresy is virtue without the difficult task of pursuing virtue.

Bilge_Pump

2021-01-21 at 19:33

Let me tell you about an experience I had with the military. Not sure how else to say this, but recruiters and enlisters expect you to lie about your entire life history. Summoned to court for a missing headlight 7 years ago? Don’t mention it when they ask you to. Had multiple surgeries, some of which could very well compromise your ability to fight? Don’t mention them.

Ofc if you lie about anything during the enlistment process, the FBI / CIA has dirt on you that they can use against you at any time if they feel the need. The military DEPENDS on corruption and lying.

f6187

2021-01-20 at 16:06

The U.S. military is in fine shape. No diversity hires anywhere in sight out on the marsh this morning:

James

2021-01-21 at 17:18

I think you linked the wrong youtube video/stream.

That said, there aren’t many diversity hires in actual combat positions. It’s almost entirely white men of germano-celtic extraction.

f6187

2021-01-21 at 17:22

“I think you linked the wrong youtube video/stream.”

It’s the same live stream that R7 linked yesterday. It’s nothing but gray at the moment, so maybe everything blew up and they don’t want to show it.

Dharmicreality

2021-01-20 at 17:07

Guess itâ€™s done and dusted now and all speculation can be set aside. Joe Biden officially the 46th President of the US.

Encelad

2021-01-20 at 17:15

At least this will end the QAnon larp.

Just kidding, they will come up with some obscure explanation to why the “Storm” is still imminent.

Ace

2021-01-20 at 17:18

Doomsday cults tend to have people hang on forever, but their numbers decline as the predictions continue to be wrong.

Theshadowedknight

2021-01-20 at 18:22

Tim Pool had it on his Twitter. Trust the Plan. “Sleepy” Joe? More like “Sleeper-agent Joe, amirite!” So not only does Q paralyze the right, but now they begin turning them to the Democratic Party’s arms. Fucking amazing. Truly a masterpiece.

Vox is going on a banning spree now that people are pointing out that he was nuts. That’s not going to turn his blog into more of an echo chamber. The majority of the right wing pundit class are furious with the pardons. Total bitchmade move by Trump, and it finishes him as political player. The midterms would be a bloodbath even without fraud. Fuck, they could ease up on the fixing just for the optics and the GOP is still totally fucked.

Catholic Sheepdog

2021-01-20 at 19:04

Well, the thing is people need to remember that there were human beings behind Q. Trump could very well have been behind Q in some fashion and still have failed.

Further, I could also hypothesize that even if Trump was behind Q, that I would distrust it in general because it is not exactly wise to really advertise what you are planning on public. I was listening to BAP one time, and he said that Q wasn’t entirely bad despite the “trust the plan” shit because it redpilled boomers about possibly the true nature of the uniparty and the elites.

It could also have been possible that Q was an intelligence operation aimed in some way at Trump himself. Perhaps someone in his inner circle ran Q and had Trump convinced that he had enough loyalists to save the republic.

Regardless, Vox isn’t nuts to hold out hope even till the end that there was some kind of plan. Just give up and don’t hope right?

There is one thing that boggles my mind still. I read the court cases and the affadavits, and I witnessed the fraud go down right in front of us. Was I really expected to believe all along, that there would be no american patriots with any power in the background capable of stopping the fraud? So I won’t be flaming Vox xD

Ace

2021-01-20 at 19:32

I was on 4chan when Qanon was created. It was a trolling that turned into a sort of cult/religion. Trump had anything to do with it. The longer it went on, the less rational it became. If anyone’s running it, it’s the left.

Ace

2021-01-20 at 19:33

Nothing* not anything.

Catholic Sheepdog

2021-01-20 at 23:03

I remember how it started and while I would generally only look infrequently at 4chan over the last decade I would still be disinclined to merely call it a troll or a LARP in their terms.

I mean some of it certainly was.

Did you see the Steinbart stuff where he claimed he was involved in time travel and shit. Pretty funny tbh

Pooch

2021-01-20 at 19:56

Fuck, they could ease up on the fixing just for the optics and the GOP is still totally fucked.

The pathetic thing about them is they still think they can win elections after completely alienating their base and the Democrats openly cheating on a massive scale. It’s like this Russian opposition guy waltzing into Moscow as if Putin was just going to allow him to have power as an opposition leader. The rude awakening they are in for in the midterms and beyond is going to be something to behold.

Theshadowedknight

2021-01-20 at 20:06

What is Navalny’s deal? Is he a true believer or just an opportunist. The convictions for embezzlement say opportunist and grifter, but that could be him getting hit for transferring money to or from the wrong account. Anyone have a good analysis on him I can read?

pdimov

2021-01-21 at 02:12

I’ve found that usually the answer to “what is X’s deal anyway?” is “he’s an intelligence asset.”

Theshadowedknight

2021-01-21 at 06:14

Yeah, but if the Russians and Putin could pin that on him it would be to their benefit. Discredit the opposition party for years. It wouldn’t surprise me, but you would think that only a true believer would walk into Moscow thinking he couldn’t be touched. Unless he intended to be arrested for the propaganda value. Not very smart of the USA IC to be playing games with other nations’ elections, but no one has accused them of being bright; they only glow in the dark.

Gestahlt

2021-01-20 at 22:15

The GOP dug its own grave and Trump dove into it with them. We’re on our own.

James Thornton

2021-01-20 at 22:42

Vox has gone off the deep end. He refuses to admit he was wrong for peddling qtardery for years, and just keeps digging a deeper hole, banning and ignoring criticism. I’ve lost a lot of respect for him, I used to trust his analysis. Even Owen Benjamin, his friend / business partner, who believes in kooky stuff like flat earth, saw right through the Qtardation, but Vox refuses to acknowledge he was wrong. Vox’s argument roughly seems to be that promoting a falsehood which raises morale is better than accurately analyzing the world.

The silver lining to qtardery is that it has pruned my information sources, removing credibility from some people that didn’t deserve it.

Catholic Sheepdog

2021-01-20 at 23:00

I didn’t think Q would come true, because it seemed that if it was Trump would have had much greater success.

But just because someone did think it was something related to Trump doesn’t mean that I will reject all their analysis about everything.

I think Martin Luther was an idiot, but his book on the Jews is pretty spot on.

clovis

2021-01-21 at 01:17

How is it that an idiot theologian wasn’t able to be refuted by any of his contemporaries in Catholic Europe?

Mike

2021-01-21 at 03:16

Has nothing to do with if it was properly refuted or not and everything to do with the fact that secular leaders, some of them anyway, aligned with its goals. There were a multitude of erudite critiques and Catholic apologetics against Luther at the time. They didn’t matter, because the princes decide what happens in this world.

clovis

2021-01-21 at 04:47

@Mike
“There were a multitude of erudite critiques and Catholic apologetics against Luther at the time.”

Name one.

2021-01-21 at 06:54

Yes. Luther provided some good excuses for princes to get out from under the Pope’s thumb and grab some monastery owned land. Thing is, the theologians still wanted one big universal (“catholic” means universal in Greek) church, just reformed, not a fragmentation into multiple churches. It was the princes who caused the later.

Catholic Sheepdog

2021-01-21 at 05:09

Refutation had nothing to do with Luther’s successes. His “Sola Fide” position is quite obviously refuted by scripture itself with a word for word contradiction, and there were quite a number of catholic theologians and saints who pointed that out to him. He then of course decided to remove that book from the canon of the NT until his successors put it back in.

If a word for word explicit contradiction of Luther’s position elucidated by scripture itself isn’t a refutation, nothing can refute him then in your eyes.

clovis

2021-01-21 at 06:16

“Refutation had nothing to do with Lutherâ€™s successes. His â€œSola Fideâ€ position is quite obviously refuted by scripture itself with a word for word contradiction, and there were quite a number of catholic theologians and saints who pointed that out to him. He then of course decided to remove that book from the canon of the NT until his successors put it back in.”

No, it’s far from obvious that “scripture alone” refutes Sola Fide. Luther’s critics typically tried to corner him by getting him to argue that church councils and the Pope could err–this was Eck’s success at his debate with Luther at Leipzig. They were not able to refute him on the basis of Scripture alone, and usually admitted it. And later counter-reformation apologetics tacitly acknowledge this by arguing that Scripture alone is insufficient for doctrine–you also need the unwritten traditions of the apostles, of which, along with Scripture, the magisterium headed by the Pope are the only authorized interpreters. There would be no need to develop this line of argument if Luther and sola fide could be refuted by Scripture alone. But Rome was forced to develop this way of arguing specifically in response to Luther’s challenge.

With reference to your second point–you are referring to James, misinterpreting James, and mistakenly claiming that Luther tried to take James out of the canon. Responses to the claim that James refutes sola fide are as old as the Augsburg Confession, and if you aren’t familiar with them, you need to brush up before calling Luther “an idiot.” As for Luther “taking James out of the canon,” this is simply a false claim. He did no such thing, nor did the Lutheran churches after him. He did question the canonicity of the letter, but so did the early church, along with 2 Peter, 2 and 3 John, and Revelation. If all the churches in the first two centuries did not acknowledge those 5 letters as canonical, decrees by Popes and later councils don’t settle the question of the canon, except for people who have already accepted the priority of the pope or councils over Scripture.

Catholic Sheepdog

2021-01-21 at 13:26

Your problem is reading comprehension.

I didn’t say that scripture alone refutes faith alone. I said that “faith alone” is explicitly contradicted word for word by the letter of St James. It is irrelevant whether or not you hold scripture alone or not, all that matters is that you hold that scripture is true, and that the Letter of St James is true and part of Scripture.

Martin Luther admitted this, and this is why he called it an “epistle of straw”. He didn’t liek the fact that he was explicitly word for word contradicted by scripture itself on his primary sola ie: sola fide.

His followers to this day have tried to find excuses and interpretations of the letter to avoid this contradiction, but words mean what they mean.

I also never said that the Lutheran churches took out the Letter of St James. I said that Luther did – He said it was an epistle of straw and that it cannot be taken at the same standard as the Letters of St Paul – thereby attacking its inspiration and therefore canonicity.

The later lutheran churches accept its canonicity but make up various bullshit to avoid the explicit contradiction in the letter.

The Cominator

2021-01-21 at 16:19

Even if Luther isn’t perfect on everything the Catholic church since Dictatus Papae has been guilty of the Donatist heresy by its own standards, there is no historical tradition back to Christ or even Constantine of an Ultramonatist papacy and ultramonatism (claiming the church is exempt from all secular discipline, and above the secular rulers besides) is a donatist doctrine. The Catholic Church thus is not supported by either tradition OR sola scriptura and stands condemned by its own standards. The Orthodox church doesn’t have this problem.

I’m not even sure what kind of heresy the pope claiming to be essentially the mouthpiece of God is…

2021-01-21 at 16:37

@TheCominator

>since Dictatus Papae has been guilty of the Donatist heresy by its own standards

Huh? Donatists said priests who have gravely sinned have no spiritual authority, DP gives a lot of spiritual AND wordly authority to the Pope, indeed the Ultramontanist stuff, deposing Emperors etc. but it has nothing to do with Donatism because it does not say the Pope cannot or does not commit gravely sins.

However, Canon Law does say that every priest who openly denies doctrine is considered ipso facto resigned, without this resignation needing a legal form, he just lost the office. So Francis with his pro-homo stuff could be considered resigned and thus not a valid Pope…

I am mentioning it because I think that is how all this spiritual authority, even that infallibility stuff should be interpreted. Popes do not have any kind of special protection from sin, and their spiritual authority does not come from somehow being less prone to sin than others. What they are considered to have is some kind of specially inspired knowledge. Which is why it is not sinning but teaching falsehoods is how they would lose their office. You don’t fire the professor for boning a female student, you fire him for claiming the Earth is flat.

Post Author 2021-01-21 at 18:57

The core of the Donatist heresy is that the Emperor, and earthly authorities, should not influence the selection of Bishops.

It is all about who gets the apples on that applecart.

The Cominator

2021-01-21 at 16:41

I did not say the ultramonatist church incorporates ALL doctrines of the Donatist heresy, just the doctrine exalting the church’s spiritual authority on earth over all other authorities.

So yes the RCC is only PARTIALLY Donatist, its not all Donatist.

Oh and to show that god or gnon has a sense of humor Gregory’s partisans to justify these extraordinary claims forged a document known as the “DONATION” of Constantine.

2021-01-21 at 16:48

@TheCominator

A bit about this Ultramontanist stuff. OK so there used to be a country called the Roman Empire, it had a monarch, and the Bishop of Rome was subordinate to that monarch and all was well. And of course the bishop of the capitol could be considered a more important priest than all the others.

Then this empire fragmented into countries but the Bishop of Rome still claims not only spiritual, but even wordly authority over them. Which is the Ultramontanist problem.

But consider that the Roman Empire was not considered something that is simply over. A lot of rulers had tried to resurrect it, think Charlemagne, think Holy Roman Empire, because it was seen as an ideal that all Christians should live in one country. Some kind of uniting all white Christian countries, so effectively reinstalling the Roman Empire has been a dream of a lot of people all over the whole political spectrum. Even the EU is some sort of a bastard offshoot of that. Even Oswald Mosley spent his postwar years advocating for some kind of an EU-like unity…

So I guess there is a deeper problem than just Ultramontanism. It is that a lot of people all over the political spectrum are unwilling to accept nationalism.

The Cominator

2021-01-21 at 16:59

Well evenl that argument doesn’t even help the legitimacy of the papacy.

The Western Capital by the time of Constantine wasn’t Rome it was Mediolanum (modern day Milan, and yes towards the very end the capital moved again to Ravenna) and the bishops of Milan tended to be more powerful from Constantine on then the bishops of Rome until the Empire fell.

Nationalism is the limit of scale to mankinds tribal nature… even most theoretically universal religions are very bad at overcoming it. This btw was the point on which Stalin realized that purist communism was very wrong. Islam as bad as it is otherwise seems like the best universal religion for truly overcoming this no other universal religion really does a good job of it all.

Catholic Sheepdog

2021-01-21 at 18:34

@Cominator

It is funny you mention the Donatist heresy because a great deal of the arguments with respect to them concerned the nature of sacraments being valid, the nature of venial and mortal sin & its effects on ministers, from this the nature of holy orders etc.

Much of this is proof that 1,000 years before Luther a great deal of what passes for catholic sacramental theology was present in the tradition. Which in itself is a refutation of Luther, should there be any belief in a Church founded by Christ.

From what I have seen here on the blog, is that Jim believes that there was a golden age in the church of england when they kept their women under control and that this lead to great fertility and expansion. There is a truth to this, but at the same time I am inclined to comment as someone who is not protestant that this decline is expected because God didn’t start the protestant church.

As a catholic I can read St Augustine on the validity of sacraments and see the exact sacramental theology of the church that it teaches today. The church has had some bad periods, the arian crisis would have broken a church that wasn’t the body of christ imo. The corruption of the church in the 9th and 10th centuries around rome was terrible, and in the time of luther it was shit again.

I believe in the resurrection of Christ, and I believe he started a Church to be the foundation of the truth and gave the power to bind and loose to said Church, and that He will be with this Church to the end of time. Even if all seems bleak and the successors of the apostles seem to fail and run away – like in the agony in the garden, nonetheless I will believe in Jesus Promise that the gates of hell will not prevail, no matter how close to victory it seems they have gotten.

Post Author 2021-01-21 at 18:42

> I am inclined to comment as someone who is not protestant that this decline is expected because God didnâ€™t start the protestant church.

God did not start the Roman Catholic Church either. The Papacy was a rebellion against Orthodoxy.

All Christians should be Orthodox. Orthodox Churches should be national but in communion, and the sovereign should have substantial influence over the selection of Bishops, and on rare and unusual occasions, purge and and appoint them. Russian orthodoxy is the model, and Anglicanism from 1660 to 1832 is also the model.

The papacy, not protestantism, was the first big rebellion, and the protestants were right to rebel against the Pope coveting what was Caesar’s

Anglicanism from 1660 to 1832 (and theoretically to the present) had the sovereign as head of the Church. This is a bad idea. Solomon rightly killed one chief priest and rightly appointed another, but thereafter, for as long as monarchy of Israel ruled in Jerusalem, chief priests were succeeded by a son or close kin of the previous chief priest, with the Sovereign strongly influencing the religion, but not outright directing it.

The book of proverbs was issued, and from time to time reissued, by the court of the King. This parallels the development of Anglican book of common prayer and book of homilies – direct monarchical influence over the interpretation and application of the unchanging doctrine of the Church.

Dave

2021-01-21 at 23:07

“Islam as bad as it is otherwise seems like the best universal religion for truly overcoming [nationalism]”

Islam cannot even overcome tribalism. One white guy converted to Islam and moved to Egypt to learn more about it. There he discovered that everyone belongs to a certain sub-sub-sub-sub-branch of Islam that just happens to have one of his cousins as its chief religious authority.

clovis

2021-01-21 at 23:51

@catholic sheepdog

You claimed Martin Luther is an idiot, or you think he is. I think John Calvin is a heretic, but even with my very limited reading of Calvin, I know he’s not an idiot. Likewise Robert Bellarmine, though a heretic, was not an idiot. A lot of calumnies were levelled at Luther in his day by followers of the Pope, but “idiot” typically wasn’t one of them. The only Catholics who say things like that today are fundamentally unserious, uneducated internet “trad Caths.” You trot out James like this argument hasn’t been heard and answered 500 years ago, but you aren’t even familiar with the answers. Your contempt for Luther’s intellect does no damage to Luther but reveals a lot about you to anyone who has actually studied these things even superficially.

Catholic Sheepdog

2021-01-22 at 01:59

@clovis

I meant that Luther was an idiot in the sense that he is catastrophically wrong about most things. One can indeed be quite intelligent and indeed knowledgeable and yet end up wrong.

I am well aware of the mountains of ink having been used to generate arguments for or against Luther.

Regardless, Luthers proposition “Sola Fide” really is refuted by the letter of St James explicitly.

I have no real desire to go into an indepth discussion on the theology of santifying vs actual grace, the gifts and fruits of the holy spirit, the infusion of virtues both theological and cardinal, and what it really means to have the indwelling of the Holy Trinity within you and what that does in your soul and whether or not the orthodox idea of divinisation is really different from what the catholic calls the indwelling of the Holy Trinity.

@jim

I would consider your idea that orthodoxy is superior to protestantism as self-evident since I would argue that the catholic and orthodox churches are the same church except that the two sides are in schism with each other. They both trace their lineage back to apostolic times and have wide ranging agreement on almost everything and the things they disagree on are often far too complex for most people.

I could never turn around and say to an orthodox christian that their church wasn’t started by Jesus Christ and that it wasn’t apostolic. It clearly is. I can say that the patriarch michael of constantinople in 1054 was wrong to start a schism.

For me the 2 argument that clinches is as follows.

1. Since both churches hold that ecumenical councils of bishops are indeed infallible the fact that the eastern bishops signed the council documents in Florence that ends their claim to be theologically correct.

2. Since every previous schism before 1054, it was obvious that Rome was correct for whatever reason I do not have grounds to accept the eastern claim that *this* time they are in the right.

In my opinion the real reason why union never occurred permanently was due to the many sins committed by both sides against each other.

Post Author 2021-01-22 at 03:47

> I can say that the patriarch michael of constantinople in 1054 was wrong to start a schism.

Nuts.

Your history is bunkum.

The Schism started when Humbert of Silva Candida entered Constantinopleâ€™s cathedral, Hagia Sophia, and excommunicated the clergy of Constantinople root and branch, starting with Michael, patriarch of Constantinople.

Michael did not schism. Rome schismed.

The Church of Rome, in pursuit of earthly power, coveting that which is Caesar’s, excommunicated the Church and clergy of Constantinople. The Church of Constantinople did not excommunicate the Church of Rome.

The great obstacle to Christian unity that led to the protestant rebellion was the Roman Catholic’s pursuit of earthly power, which got up the noses of Kings, starting with the Normans.

In the conflict between the Bishop of Rome and the Patriarch of Constantinople, the Patriarch was trying to steal Churches, and the Bishop of Rome trying to steal Kingdoms.

The Patriarch of Constantinople wanted his people conducting rites and giving sermons. The Bishop of Rome wanted his people telling armies where they should fight.

The proximate cause of the disagreement was Rome’s war with the Normans.

Well, when there is a war going, it is unsurprising that Ukrainian Orthodoxy has disagreements with Russian orthodoxy, but they manage to remain Orthodox for all that, because that is Caesar’s business.

Martin Luther got backing from the princes, because the Bishop of Rome was applying religious authority in foreign countries to overthrow the sovereigns of those countries.

If you want one universal Church, it cannot be so universal that it gets involved in this stuff. And so the sovereign has to have substantial influence over the appointment of Bishops of the state church, resulting in a different flavor of Orthodoxy for each genuinely sovereign nation.

Catholic Sheepdog

2021-01-23 at 00:25

@Jim

First I would agree with you that the act which finalised the schism was of Humbert. However, this excommunication didn’t just drop out of the heavens on a pure-hearted, blameless & non-schismatic Patriarch in Constantinople.

The reality is that Caeularius was the cause of the quarrel and when he removed the Popes name from the Diptychs in 1042, this act itself would have been seen as almost as serious & every bit as insulting as Humberts excommunication and Caerularius’s reactionary excommunication.

Ask a catholic priest if you know one, what would happen if he were to refuse to name Pope Francis after the “una cum” in the mass. If a priest would persist after warning he will be excommunicated. This actually happened recently in the US.

From the point of view of liturgical and canon law, an excommunication of the Patriarch as early as a few months after he had removed the pope’s name from the Dipytchs would have been entirely justified.

Of course as you are not a catholic or an orthodox christian I can’t assume that you are knowledgeable about liturgical and canon law especially at the time of that schism. Perhaps such laws are not important to you as a protestant, but since you seem to at least have a high respect for orthodoxy I would ask you to consider such laws as having a higher significance that perhaps you have considered previously.

This removal of the pope’s name from the Dipytchs wasn’t the only thing that the patriarch had been up to either. He and his associates were calling the latins heretics etc etc.

So no I don’t agree that Humbert’s action was entirely unjustified or that blaming Caerularius for the schism is as you put it “NUTS”. Within the context of the universal church at that time, and with a consideration of liturgical and canon law, the blame for the schism is entirely at the feet at the patriarch.

The blame that I would put on Humbert is that he wasn’t wise enough to solve the crisis created by the patriarch. I blame Humbert for failure in peacemaking, but Caerularius for the schism.

Lest you think I am one of those with rose coloured glasses, I blame the crusaders who sacked Constantinople for making it impossible to this day to have a reunion of the east & west.

With respect to the second point I must confess to not being an expert on the wars over the south of Italy with the Normans and the political situation at the time. But wasn’t it the case that the Byzantine Emperor and the Pope were in agreement that something had to be done against the Normans and the emperor had even asked the Pope for help?

The serious political disagreements that inhibited reunion came later with one example noted above (even though of course the seeds of such problems were always there), but as far as I can recall at that time the Byzantine Emperor and the Pope had good relations.

As for the rest of your reply, I don’t think I have reflected as much as you have on the tension between Caesar and God, and the famous verse concerning that which ought to be rendered to Caesar and that which ought to be rendered to God. I would also say that my knowledge of the investiture controversy is very basic and I would retreat from talking about that which I have not studied nor spent time to understand. So please don’t think I ignore that part of your reply.

I do however, have a question for you.

At times reading your comments I get the sense that your reason for being Christian is that to save your country from the “holiness spiral” of the left you need to supplant this leftism with a non-pozzed Christianity. Of course I agree with the idea, that one should smash the left and have a state Christian religion, and that having a good Church and a good Caesar will go a long long way to solving a lot of issues. Nonetheless I can’t shake the sense that your main reason for being a Christian is fundamentally a natural one.

However, at other times I also have gotten the sense that your reason for being Christian is that you believe in the Resurrection of Jesus Christ and that you believe Him to be the Son of the Father.

Therefore, I would like to ask you how you would interpret what I am about to say about my own faith.

I believe in Jesus Christ, because He is God and He rose from the dead. I believe I should be a patriot because love of my country is a virtue and requirement of justice towards my neighbors. However, ultimately Jesus comes first, and that I should obey God before I obey any other man even Caesar and I expect Caesar to obey God.

Regards.

Post Author 2021-01-23 at 03:54

> First I would agree with you that the act which finalised the schism was of Humbert. However, this excommunication didnâ€™t just drop out of the heavens on a pure-hearted, blameless & non-schismatic Patriarch in Constantinople.

The Patriarch of Constatinople did all manner of bad things, and the Bishops of Rome did all manner of bad things.

But the bad things the Patriarch of Constantinople did were aimed a stealing Churches and getting his friends jobs giving sermons and conducting rituals, whereas the bad things Bishops of Rome did were aimed at stealing Kingdoms and conquering lands, and this was causing the same problems as it continued to cause all the way to the sack of Rome.

The fundamental problem was and is that Rome coveted what was Caesar’s. And this continued to cause trouble, most spectacularly the protestant reformation, and continues to cause trouble today.

The fundamental heresy of Rome was and is Donatism.

As I said, in order for orthodoxy to be a state religion, and in order for it to be one religion in several states, the sovereign of a particular land needs to have a great deal of influence over who gets to be Bishop in that land.

Donatism is, in practice, in contradiction to Paul’s command to obey the sovereign. A Donatist priesthood always winds up trying to overthrow a sovereign in favor of some foreign sovereign, which is what caused the princes to protect Luther.

> I believe in Jesus Christ, because He is God and He rose from the dead.

Do you now?

And which Jesus Christ is that? Give me the affirmation.

> I believe I should be a patriot because love of my country is a virtue and requirement of justice towards my neighbors. However, ultimately Jesus comes first, and that I should obey God before I obey any other man even Caesar and I expect Caesar to obey God.

The problem is that this is apt to be a rationale for the priest coveting that which is Caesar’s. Which was a massive problem leading to rivers of blood from the time of great schism to the sack of Rome.

By their fruits you will know them, and the fruits of papal supremacy were rivers of blood, that never diminished until they washed over Rome itself.

The Pope was not at war with kingdoms because they were protestant. Rather, Catholic Kingdoms turned protestant because he was at war with their Kings. It was not a protestant King that sacked Rome.

clovis

2021-01-23 at 01:23

@catholic sheepdog

“I have no real desire to go into an indepth discussion on the theology of santifying vs actual grace, the gifts and fruits of the holy spirit, the infusion of virtues both theological and cardinal… and what the catholic calls the indwelling of the Holy Trinity.”

I’d agree with you that this wouldn’t be the place and would probably be a waste of your time. But as you recognize, and catholic theology recognizes, that the word “grace” in the New Testament has multiple senses–it can mean the favor of God, and it can also mean the gift of God that follows His favor–so you should recognize that the word “justify” and its has multiple senses in Scripture. Sometimes it refers to justification before God, as in Romans 3: “For we hold that a man is justified by faith apart from works of law.” At other times it refers to justification or vindication before other people, as in Luke 16:15. When James says that Abraham is “justified by works and not by faith alone,” he goes on to say, “In the same way was not also Rahab the harlot justified by works when she received the messengers and sent them out another way? For as the body without the apart from the spirit is dead, so faith apart from works is dead.” The point James is making is not that works merit righteousness before God, but that a faith without works “is dead.” Nevertheless the New Testament makes clear over and over again that righteousness and justification before God are not received by working and doing, and thus by “law,” but as a promise, and therefore by faith. “What then shall we say about Abraham…If Abraham was justified by works, he has something to boast about, but not before God. What does the Scripture say? ‘Abraham believed God, and it was reckoned to him for righteousness.’ Now to the one who works, his wages are not reckoned as a gift, but as his due. And to the one who does not work, but trusts him who justifies the ungodly, his faith is reckoned as righteousness. So also David pronounces blessing upon the one to whom God reckons rightoeusness apart from works: ‘Blessed are those whose iniquities are forgiven, and whose sins are covered; blessed is the man against whom the Lord will not reckon his sin.'” (Rom. 4:1-8)

Paul writes this way in many, many places, and a prooftext from James by no means undoes the justification by faith alone. James certainly refutes the idea that one can be justified before God by faith without also being justified before men by good works. But that is a text that speaks much more loudly against the Roman clergy for the last five hundred years than it does against Lutherans.

The Cominator

2021-01-23 at 02:18

You are overcomplicating the real cause of the dispute, the bishop of Rome claimed insane powers that the bishop of Rome NEVER traditionally had (in fact bishops of Rome had been tried and legally deposed before, Belisarius deposed one for collobaration with the OstroGoths) and which of course none of the other patriarchs nor the Emperor in Constantinople were ever going to accept. Not even theoretically Catholic monarchs could ever really accept them in practice.

If the bishop of Rome had issued dictatus papae in the time of Constantine he would have either been deposed and executed (as a Donatist heretic among other things) or deposed and locked up as a madman.

Catholic Sheepdog

2021-01-23 at 16:52

@Jim — You say

“The core of the Donatist heresy is that the Emperor, and earthly authorities, should not influence the selection of Bishops.

It is all about who gets the apples on that applecart.”

I must admit that I don’t agree with this assertion. Donatism has much more to do with what you would call a “holiness spiral”. The donatists refused to have communion with those who they called “Traditors” who didn’t stand tall against Diocletian.

The Donatist problem in the eyes of the Church at that time was a denial of the sacramental theology of Holy Orders, a denial of the efficacy of penance, and to be quite frank hypocrisy as Augustine would point out that Donatists would be convicted of drunkenness etc.

However, let’s say I to grant to you that the “core” of the Donatist heresy was indeed mainly about who gets to appoint the Bishops and that earthly authorities should not influence the selection of Priests & Bishops.

This was not the aspect under which the Donatists were condemned and fought against.

As such, a Catholic or an Orthodox Christian either, could not assert that refusal of Caesar’s influence over the selection of Bishops was condemned by the condemnation of Donatism.

——

Further, you say

“Donatism is, in practice, in contradiction to Paulâ€™s command to obey the sovereign.”

What is your exegesis of Acts 5:29?

Clearly there is a tension between this verse and Romans 13. This tension is right there in the Gospels with the quote I have already mentioned above. “Render unto Caesar the things which are Caesar’s and to God that which is God’s”.

——

Further, you say

“whereas the bad things Bishops of Rome did were aimed at stealing Kingdoms and conquering lands,”

This wasn’t all. At this time, the church had major problems with simony and nepotism. Lots of rich and powerful families in Italy were vying for control over the papacy with the various “Caesars” at the time.

What is your opinion of nepotism and simony with respect to the offices of the Church?

—–

Further, you say

“The fundamental problem was and is that Rome coveted what was Caesarâ€™s”

I disagree. I think the fundamental problem is that Caesar always covets what is Gods. When the Church has power and is respected in earthly affairs the rich and powerful and Caesar will covet this power. This is what leads to the practices of simony and nepotism. These are sins that Caerularius was up to as well.

Your idea that Orthodoxy will only work as a state religion if Caesar has control over who sits on what See, is an interesting political philosophy. How often in practice have we had good Christian kings and clergy at the same time in history? I mean I don’t consider your “golden age” in england to be relevant in this matter, because anglicans are heretics. Strictly speaking they can’t even be seen as a church because they have lost holy orders and as such are no longer apostolic. The Orthodox have the same view as the Catholics in this matter.

—–

Further, you say

“The problem is that this is apt to be a rationale for the priest coveting that which is Caesarâ€™s”

Funny you should say that. I am not a US citizen but if I were I would have voted for Trump. Further, Joe Biden is ipso facto excommunicated and Pope Francis is a worse pope than the popes at the height of the problems in the papacy, in the 1000’s when simony and nepotism reigned and again in the years before and just after the reformation.

The thing is, it is clear that both of us resolve the tension in the verse “Render unto Caesar the things which are Caesar’s and to God that which is God’s” in different ways.

——

As regards Cominator mentioning Belisarius. Relevant to papal supremacy.

Why was Theodoret so concerned with getting her man onto the papacy to re-appoint her favoured patriarch who was condemned and deposed if the pope had no such authority to do so?

I am more than willing to agree that popes in the past were bad and did things that they shouldn’t and that they tried to get powers in earthly affairs that they shouldn’t be trying to get. However, the evidence is that the popes did have powers over the universal church because if they didn’t many things that happened make no sense.

If the pope had no authority over the other bishops, Theodoret would not have tried to get her man into the See.

In the schism of Photius, when Ignatius was deposed by the emperor, both sides sent letters of appeal to Rome, and the Schism started when the Pope ruled for Ignatius. Makes no sense to appeal to papal authority if he had none.

——

As for affirmation

Jesus Christ is Lord. Born in Bethlehem, died in Jerusalem, and is, is from before the beginning of the world. Wholly man and wholly God, God is three and God is one.

@clovis- maybe tomorrow

Post Author 2021-01-23 at 19:47

> > â€œThe problem is that this is apt to be a rationale for the priest coveting that which is Caesarâ€™sâ€

> The thing is, it is clear that both of us resolve the tension in the verse â€œRender unto Caesar the things which are Caesarâ€™s and to God that which is Godâ€™sâ€ in different ways.

If the religion is the state religion of a Kingdom, and the Pope is summoning armies hostile to that Kingdom, obviously not rendering unto Caesar.

Pope Leo, like his predecessors, was appointed by the emperor of the west, while the Patriarch of Constantinople, was appointed by the Emperor of the East. And then the emperor of the west moved back to Germany, and we see the Pope commanding armies in the field, leading Roman Catholics against Roman Catholics.

And then we get the great schism, shortly followed by a Pope appointed in defiance of the “Roman” emperor of the west, shortly followed by the forgery of the Donation of Constantine. (It was forged earlier, but it was only made official after the western empire retreated from Italy)

This stuff is a totally unambiguous violation of rendering unto Caesar.

The great schism immediately followed the Pope exercising extensive Kingly power in Italy. If that power had been exercised by a Germanic noble or Norman Kinglet, there would have been no schism.

As long as the Bishop of Rome and the Patriarch of Constantinople were appointed by their separate sovereigns, no problem, there was one Church with the united Church doing a great deal to preserve comity between their separate and frequently conflicting sovereigns.

As soon as the Bishop of Rome becomes a sovereign, big problem.

The great schism, and the subsequent heresies about the earthly power of Popes, were a direct and immediate consequence of the Pope stepping into the power vacuum created by the retreat of the “Roman” emperor from Rome.

The Cominator

2021-01-23 at 17:46

“As regards Cominator mentioning Belisarius. Relevant to papal supremacy.

Why was Theodoret so concerned with getting her man onto the papacy to re-appoint her favoured patriarch who was condemned and deposed if the pope had no such authority to do so?”

Not the point the point was the bishop of Rome was put on trial and legally deposed by representatives of the true head of Christendom at that time, the Emperor in Constantinople.

Catholic Sheepdog

2021-01-23 at 22:10

@Jim

I would like to reply to your last, but I don’t want to misunderstand your position.

Could you elaborate on your understanding of the Photian schism after the deposition of Patriarch Ignatius due to Ignatius refusing communion to Bardas on the feast of the epiphany?

Was the pope wrong to defend the deposed Ignatius?

James Thornton

2021-01-21 at 03:48

I agree, but where once I would give him the benefit of the doubt when I didn’t understand or agree with something he said, I now will not.

I’m trying to follow Jim’s advice (and general good practice) to rely more on primary sources instead of interpretations of interpretations of interpretations. For example I’m now reading “The Life and Curious Adventures of Peter Williamson”, an autobiographical account of a Scottish slave in America in the 1700s. Also The Gulag Archipelago, to get a feel for what’s coming.

Just curious, why do you think Luther was an idiot? I have no opinion, don’t know much about him other than the standard high school stuff.

Catholic Sheepdog

2021-01-23 at 00:40

I meant to reply earlier.

For me, I think he is an idiot for spending years trying to put a square peg into a triangle shaped hole.

Sola Fide “Faith Alone” is explicitly contradicted by Scripture and as such no matter the tomes written to escape this contradiction , the Lutheran position “man is saved by faith alone” is quite simply wrong. Scripture explicitly says “not by faith alone”. A more explicit contradiction of Lutherans position cannot be stated.

That’s why.

Epstein's Suicide Note

2021-01-21 at 00:49

Promoting unfalsifiable ideas that raise morale can be a good thing. The closer those unfalsifiable ideas get to outright unbelievable falsehood, the more destructive they become, with progressives showing us the terminal end of that journey.

It’s always sad to see people “losing it”, but that is after all one of the laws of Gnon, and certainly the most important law of capitalism, that generally something must be destroyed in order to free up resources for new and better competitors. I don’t know how long it will take, or how bad things will get in the meantime, but there will be others – new movements, new leaders, hopefully better ones.

Post Author 2021-01-21 at 01:09

That our military is competent, effective, and has the spiritual strength to resist political correctness that makes it incompetent and ineffective is a false hope that is falsifiable, and when Trump ceased to be president, that hope was falsified.

If the military was able and willing to defend military technology against political correctness, it would be able and willing to defend Trump against political correctness.

Time is running out for SpaceX. On the other hand, an internet in space is an asset that is not easily seized by an earth based power, which might get Musk time enough to get asteroid mining in space going, which might get him time enough to get interplanetary settlement going. But it will be tight.

Eumenes

2021-01-21 at 06:48

Elon Musk will utilize his net worth to surmount whatever nonsense the Cathedral throws at him. Bidenâ€™s Green New Deal will create more artificial demand for his electric car scam.

The genius of Tesla is in how Musk has figured out how to convert holiness into money, more specifically holiness into luxury. Tesla cars are cheap unreliable poorly-built plastic economy cars with a big screen and tons of gimmicks, yet Musk sells them at high-end luxury car prices.

If Musk is smart enough to convert holiness into him becoming the richest man in the world, I think he will be smart enough to use his funds to ensure SpaceX succeeds.

Lord

2021-01-21 at 08:05

Space travel is a meme. Only redditors believe in it. NASA knows damn well that there’s really nowhere to go with it but they and other geek heroes like Science Nigger need their toy bucks so they play along, even shove in Shaniquas.

Post Author 2021-01-21 at 08:19

Musk is going places. If he does not make it, it will be because he was stopped, not because there is any inherent barrier to elites putting a safer distance between themselves and other elites.

Pseudo-Chrysostom

2021-01-22 at 15:20

The stuff of complex civilization is energy, and hence, space travel, and many more undreamt things besides, is more than viable with the help of Our Friend, The Atom.

Not coincidentally, this herald of the new age was strangled in the crib, and civilization will remain treading water at best, unable to advance to new heights before cyclical collapses, unless and until it is rejoined.

Pseudo-chrysostom

2021-01-20 at 17:12

>biden’s first act as ‘official’ president is a senior moment forgetting he was supposed to give his address after swearing in and sitting down instead

like pottery

Mr.P

2021-01-20 at 21:45

Please, do you have a link?

I want to store and treasure the moment for posterity sake.

(I didn’t watch but did search a few key words and came up empty.)

dick@mailinator.com

2021-01-21 at 23:50

You should be able to find it from anywhere that has the full video; it’s right after the swearing in, and they’re all just sitting there as the long awkward pause drags on, before someone takes the mic again to call him back up to the stage after he had already been up at the stage.

Aspar Inscribitur

2021-01-20 at 19:18

Should one buy or sell bitcoin in the current market? Which cryptocurrencies are good, and which are bad?

The Cominator

2021-01-20 at 20:15

Jim is a better source of information on crypto than me by far.

I don’t own crypto, I own a miner that I sold calls against. As of today I’m down on the miner stock but up on my calls to the extent I’m still up 15% on the stock.

Ace

2021-01-20 at 19:29

@Cominator can you do a post about speculation? I’ve done a bit of playing in the markets based on advice around here and made a small sum from it, but I’m not really sure where to learn enough to be effective on a regular basis.

The Cominator

2021-01-20 at 19:56

My basic principles are simple

Find a company with a product or service that is very good and likely to grow and that the company is fairly cheap (if it has a 20 billion dollar market cap already there are generally better opportunities elsewhere).

THEN

Look into the management as much as you can, check for signs of stupid decisions or managements which is massively overcompensated top people instantly cash in free shares. Bad management is always a bad investment. A stupid farmer will kill the golden goose, a criminally greedy farmer (one interested mainly in embezzling out of the country) will do this as well.

If you see blatantly stupid or crooked decisions get away from the company… if you see clever decisions from the management (for instance Inseego is my biggest % holding now though I sold some today at 19 has an extremely good management which doesn’t pay themselves a lot and has never made a bad decision) than its a good company. Remember Apple before Jobs and Apple after jobs. Leadership makes all the difference.

Stay away from biotechs unless your information is very very good and you really need to understand the entire situation which normally you won’t, 1000 things can kill you in biotechs because they have massive costs and are constantly at the mercy of a corrupt government which will do favors for their big pharma competitors too.

Under Biden expect a weaker dollar and weaker small businesses (and higher commodity prices) but stocks which involve public companies that generally can pay bribes may do well… under Harris you’ll need to be careful her corruption is more motivated by power intoxication and pure evil than greed and as such she’ll be much worse and more unpredictable.

Ace

2021-01-21 at 04:41

Thanks Cominator.

The Cominator

2021-01-26 at 17:16

FYI I sold my inseego yesterday (not at the high) and most of my positions except the crypto miner…

Market due for correction especially with likely occasionally very stupid policies from the new administratio even if it will still go up due to easy money policy…

2021-01-21 at 06:48

>Stay away from biotechs

Heh. In 2008 I bought some American Oriental Biotechnology on Mark Skousen’s suggestion. Looked like they have an effective ultrasound treatment for some types of cancer and just waiting for FDA approval. And then things took a nosedive, even ending with a class action lawsuit. Lesson learned.

The Cominator

2021-01-21 at 07:00

Its not a blanket statement you can score REALLY big on them but you need to know everything…

The Cominator

2021-01-20 at 20:23

Also under Biden (but things get worse under Kamala) expect more unpredictable violent corrections in the market where the dollar temporarily strengthens but don’t expect a bear…

The print money and low interest policy will continue but stupid unpredictable spooky regulatory policies and campaigns will issue forth from time to time, not enough to cause a bear (and if they are Hunter Biden will get 100 million dollars and the policies will go away) for at least big publically traded companies… but enough to cause occasional random panics.

Harris when she gets in whenever it happens will be a lot more unpredictable…

John C. Calhoun

2021-01-20 at 20:28

Many fat ladies were singing today. Lady Gaga in particular stands out.

On another note, is it me or has anyone else noticed that most gun shops have most of their inventory sold out including both ammunition and firearms. Seems difficult to find much for sale other than .22lr rifles and ammo.

Pooch

2021-01-20 at 20:40

Been like that since the jogger riots.

Pooch

2021-01-20 at 20:44

You’re better off shopping online.

John C. Calhoun

2021-01-20 at 21:03

Online shopping is gay and is mostly done for tax avoidance purposes. Physical store buying should provide the same (if not more) value if the store clerk has good knowledge of the products and can recommend a suitable product to you based on your criteria and his years of experience.

I think online shopping works best if it is a homogenized or standardized product like a book or video game. Bigger tickets items its best to go in store.

People keep saying e-commerce is going to replace everything but they also forget that prior to brick and mortar Sears locations you had catolog buying which tried, in a low tech way, to achieve what e-commerce did.

The real reason why mainstreet is dying is due to growing property and sales taxes which e-commerce circumvents but not because it is “more efficient” as pundits suggest.

Gedeon

2021-01-21 at 01:49

You definitely donâ€™t know what you are talking about. Gun.deals is an excellent search engine to locate inventory across the market if you have a manufacturerâ€™s part number.

22lr is the same diameter projectile as an AR-15, but with a much smaller powder charge (much slower velocity) and out of a rimfire cartridge. A ruger mkiv can still be found for around $500 and, if you live in a state that permits NFA items, a dead air mask suppressor is $400 + $200 for the nfa tax stamp. For $1,100 you have a Hollywood quiet firearm that is compact, lightweight and should have long term parts availability…if anything does. Most jurisdictions that have enacted enhanced firearm restrictions have carveout exemptions for rimfire firearms also. Keep in mind that in self defense legal defenses, you will definitely have trouble defending a shooting beyond 75 yards, so factor that in your use case.

I wouldnâ€™t run into a gunfight with a 22lr, but I would take one any day over a pellet gun, bat or kitchen knife which are not mutually exclusive tools.

In general, palmetto state armory is great source for self defense tools and you can get additional money back through activejunky.

https://twitter.com/disclosetv/status/1352020808407855104?s=20

2021-01-21 at 06:45

When I was a kid in the eighties, I liked to browse my aunt’s collection of German Quelle catalogues. The camping section, tents built on trailers and stuff like that. They never bought anything, she just used the catalogues for ideas for knitting sweaters. I think the basic business model was that people would be admiring those big ticket items, like I did, will not buy them, but they will be in the mood of buying something so they will order a set of tent pegs.

Today, an e-merchant can do better, not just the shop but blog, video and offering advice on videocalls. With a generous return policy, it might work. But I would still want to touch and try that trailer tent before buying.

Pooch

2021-01-20 at 23:59

Trump is sucking just about every dick he can on his way out to keep him out of jail. He certainly is not embracing his martyrdom.

Mike

2021-01-21 at 00:23

This is by far the worst thing he did. Pardons a guy who committed mail fraud at one point, the very thing that led to Trump losing. What a totally cucked thing to do.

https://twitter.com/LeftyCrypto/status/1351762906833166339

Ace

2021-01-21 at 04:08

Cernovich seems to think Trump is going to start his own party as a sort of a way to con the rubes out their money. The left would probably like that, Trump being a sad Alex Jones once they get done impeaching him so he can never run for office again. Trump’s existing income streams will be seized shortly.

So I’ll make a prediction based on gut instinct: They’ll investigate Trump, repeatedly humiliate him and take his assists but make no serious attempt to imprison him. Instead they’ll make an example of his most committed prole followers as a warning to the proles to shut up and listen to their betters. Once it’s clear that normality isn’t returning they’ll start looking for wreckers and Trump and family will be at the top of the list, followed by anyone who supported Trump.

Pooch

2021-01-21 at 04:35

It’s really hard for me to see them not imprisoning him, especially if he’s going to try to stay involved politically. How long it takes them to do it could be indicative of how close we are to singularity.

Ace

2021-01-21 at 04:51

I don’t think they can realistically arrest Trump before they purge the Military, which is going to take a while. He would be a rally point for a lot of people who could be very effective fighters.

Prince Charming

2021-01-21 at 06:00

It would be a nice casus belli, i.e. excuse. Other than that, it’s just another “this time they’ve surely gone too far, the masses will rise up”. People are not going to rally from a position of desperate weakness, if before they repeatedly didn’t rally from the position of overwhelming strength.

They need to kick us while we’re down, and they need to finish us, and they, unlike us, have no qualms about doing so. If Trump lets himself be arrested, he better had a plan to be risen on the third day.

Ace

2021-01-22 at 18:57

It would be a nice casus belli, i.e. excuse

That’s what I was implying.

The right has a lot power, but it needs legitimacy and leadership to exercise it a cohesive fashion. Military units breaking Trump out of jail would be the sort thing that could happen. Seems unlikely to happen just like the Military moving against Biden during the inauguration was unlikely to happen, but we’re dealing with a very insecure dictatorship that desperately wants normality to return. Once the military is purged it will be much safer for them to arrest and execute Trump.

I also think this is why they’re holding off/slow walking the gun grabbing. They worried the military might get involved or worse refuse to help when the ATF/FBI gets into trouble with a raid.

Prince Charming

2021-01-22 at 22:51

How likely is it that they already ran two big queries, one to see who is important enough to matter, and another one to give everyone a social credit score. They’re already building the narrative that: “DOD policy expressly prohibits military personnel from actively advocating supremacist, extremist or criminal gang doctrine, ideology or causes. All military personnel, including members of the National Guard, have undergone a background investigation, are subject to continuous evaluation, and are enrolled in an insider threat program. Simply put, we will not tolerate extremism of any sort in DOD”[*]. The purge can be done faster than the news of the civilian arrests really sinks in. Thinking one has to wait for the other is normalcy bias.

And once that’s done, is anything in the way of denazification 2.0?

[*] The Hill

Post Author 2021-01-21 at 06:35

Sounds about right.

Epstein's Suicide Note

2021-01-21 at 15:12

I would love to see a Trump party, just for the lulz. Suggested names include TrumpiQans, TrumpAnon, and Boomer4eva. The logo should be a Kraken, and he would be running on the 100% credible platform that “even though the US Government refused for 4 years to hand over full control to me when I held the entire Republican party and associated gargantuan Military-Industrial Complex by the balls, I’m pretty sure they’ll be more amenable if I win with a much smaller organization with no existing political or business connections, and I’m pretty sure I can win because everyone likes me and elections are generally fair, despite the weird 2020 anomaly that could never happen again.”

Seriously, though, if Trump wanted to mount a full-on Andrew Jackson-style comeback in 4 years, he’d need to have a whole lot of meat shields between now and then, and I sure as hell would not take a bullet for him at this point. Does anyone know anyone who would? If he decided to take all of his most loyal supporters and start slapping them in the face with his dick, I think I’d almost enjoy watching the establishment tear him apart.

No, he’s finished politically, and will probably have his business assets seized by the SDNY soon enough. His best bet would be to flee the country, and for his sake I hope he had the foresight to acquire a dozen or so fake passports for him and his family while he was in the White House.

Post Author 2021-01-21 at 18:45

Whosoever joins the Trump party is likely to die.

Electoral politics died in the early hours of November the fourth. Attempting to continue genuine electoral politics will fail, and may well fail fataly.

Epstein's Suicide Note

2021-01-21 at 20:44

And at this point I’d be rooting for it to fail fatally. After all that we’ve seen, anyone who still doesn’t get it is overdue for a purge.

The only way any right-wing caste survives and thrives is by ruthlessly separating the wheat from the chaff. There are far too many low-quality right-wing movements out there; maybe they’re useful as cannon fodder but I’m just about done standing up for them, because they sure don’t stand up for us, and can’t even seem to stand up for themselves.

Post Author 2021-01-21 at 20:58

We should not help people who will not help themselves, but no enemies to the right.

Any criticism of the right should be from the frame that they are insufficiently right wing on some issue or another (Nazism is National Socialism), or from the frame that they are seriously out of contact with reality, and thus failing to worship Gnon (Vox Day, Qanon)

Epstein's Suicide Note

2021-01-22 at 15:57

A “Trump party” at this point in time sounds like both to me. Insufficiently right, because Trump himself proved to be insufficiently right and because it would be trying to restore democracy after the mask of democracy has finally started to drop; and out of contact with reality for all the reasons I listed earlier and hundreds more.

Prince Charming

2021-01-22 at 23:36

Perhaps not a 20c parliamentary party, but a more traditional European-style party, in the vein of Sinn Fein / IRA. If one may be permitted to dream.

Whites are good at organised violence, so we need to organise, right? But isn’t everybody who has mentioned Trump in a positive way over the past five years as good as done; what difference will it make to keep showing support? Even if new people will have to do the actually effective organising, i.e. people whose first redpill will have been to “use Signal”.

Post Author 2021-01-23 at 02:43

Nuts.

Any white organization for violence will be crushed by the (mostly white, but substantially Jewish and increasingly dot Indian) left ruling elite.

Prince Charming

2021-01-23 at 18:00

There has to be a way to organise in a way Al Quaida organises, clandestinely. Cell structure, steganography, accept likelihood of martyrdom. I guess we don’t have CIA to run us 🙁

Pooch

2021-01-23 at 19:34

Al Queada had Saudi elite backing. Bin Laden himself was a member of the Saudi elite. We have zero elite backing.

Post Author 2021-01-23 at 21:13

Bin Laden was Saudi elite and had Saudi elite backing.

We don’t.

After he lost Saudi backing, he had Pakistani backing. He was running Al Qaeda from the Pakistani equivalent of West point.

Prince Charming

2021-01-29 at 11:48

We do have elite backing. We have so much of it that we got complacent. It has looked for a very long time that we had enough elite backing to mount a coup. There is a big difference between coming up just short, and zero. Perhaps it would take just a few, maybe even just one, to tip the scales. In a 50/50 situation, a small group of men can make a big difference to the outcome.

I think this is where Moldbug’s admonition to become worthy comes to stark relief.

If guy with a phone can become an Internet guru, the same guy can become a political force; it took a bin Laden to formulate the problem of America and how to solve it, but it took nineteen boxcutters and faith to raise the army that would bring America down. If you pare al Quaeda down to the things that really made impact, you can do away with all the trappings of power, and just keep the sermons & the boxcutters. The greatest psyop of the last four years was some kid shitposting on 4chan. The choke Visa/Mastercard had on who could buy & sell was broken by a weeb writing ten thousand lines of C++ (Jim is gearing up to write ten thousand more).

We are the incipient elite. All we have to do is to stop following our passions, and start doing what needs to be done. Or perhaps the Muslims will take over, or the Left — someone will, fake & gay can only go for so long once people start noticing. The modern state provides the logistics for us. It does look like they are trying to shut it down in a hurry, but for now, what is there that we may lack, apart from character?

Post Author 2021-01-29 at 19:15

Nuts.

Bin Laden had real elite backing. He got money and arms from Saudi Arabia. When the Saudi King dropped him, realizing that more-Islamic-than-thou was a big threat, he operated from the capital of Taliban Afghanistan. When the Taliban were defeated, he operated from the Pakistani equivalent of West Point and the Pentagon, and dropped the doctrine that he was more Islamic than the rulers of Pakistan, even though the rulers of Pakistan are not all that Islamic.

The Tutsi prepared their revolt against the Rwandan regime in the neighboring country of Uganda, with whom they ethnic ties and within which they had a massive exile community. It was not a revolt, but a return of the exiles as an army, an army organized with the consent and cooperation of the Ugandan regime.

The only way we could do something similar would be to operate from Moscow or Peking, and only if we had a sufficiently massive exile community outside the American hegemony.

Notice that despite being genocided, the Tutsi within Rwanda failed to fight back, because the conditions that made the genocide possible made large scale organization impossible.

Contaminated NEET

2021-01-21 at 00:11

Hello Jim,

I’d like to collect on our 10 mBTC bet about the Biden inauguration. I’ve sent you an e-mail from a burner protonmail account with my BTC address. I had to guess at your e-mail, but I’m pretty sure I got it right. Let me know if you didn’t get it.

Post Author 2021-01-21 at 00:43

Not seeing your email. Try jim@blog.reaction.la

Contaminated NEET

2021-01-21 at 00:53

Ah, it looks like I guessed your address wrong. I’ve re-sent it to the correct address.

Contaminated NEET

2021-01-21 at 02:06

Payment received. Like my dad always said, fast pay makes fast friends. You’re a man of honor, Jim.

someDude

2021-01-21 at 14:21

That’s something that B the Israeli never understood

Contaminated NEET

2021-01-22 at 00:10

Yeah, I remember that. That’s what having 4000 years of the bazaar in your DNA will do to you.

Everything can be haggled, and every possible point that could work in your favor must be argued as strenuously as you can. It’s a winning strategy in orderly, civilized environments; it’s just too bad it sucks at creating such environments and gradually wears them away where they exist.

2021-01-22 at 12:56

Once I watched two very smart Jews do some verbal sparring just for fun. It was really like watching two master swordsmen sparring. They kept reframing and reinterpreting what the other said in entrapping ways. It looked very dangerous and effective.

I did not know what to think about this back then. I think I do now. Basically, I think those who believe the Jews are all-powerful and the source of all problems and believe removing them from the picture would fix all problems are still thinking in the framework of a world ruled by rhethorics, argument, sophistry, wordsmithing. They do not get to the root of the problem, because Jews are not the only ones good at sophistry, nor the only ones using it against other people’s interests. If the world is ruled by sophistry, it will always select for sophists. So that is what needs to be changed. The world must not be ruled by sophistry, and if that is achieved, all that Jew-magic will be nothing more than elaborate word-games with no more power than slam poetry.

So the solution is to reduce the importance and power of words. There are two ways to do that. First, demand evidence, not argument. Second, rule by the sword, not rule by argument.

These two are fairly standard ideas around here, I would like to add a third one. Rational argument is something to be had between people with the same interests, goals. People with different interests, goals should negotiate, not argue. For example, your real estate agent can argue that you are pricing the house you are selling too high, it will not clear the market. But if a potential buyer comes up with this argument, it feels inherently sleazy, right? He is not there to help you, he is there to make a good deal for himself.

I mean mentioning this because I have plenty of sorta lofty-minded friends who sigh exasperatedly and say stuff like why politics cannot be decided by rational debate, instead of all this shouting and occasional violence. And the answer is that rational debate is only possible if all want the same thing. If it is not so, it must be negotiation, not debate. But the whole lie of democratic politics is that everybody has the same interests, so “we” pretend to rationally debate what to do. When in reality there are very, very opposite interests at play.

grumpy

2021-01-22 at 13:08

Demand evidence for the trinity from scriptures.

Nothing, zilch.

Jim is a master sophist a coward, and a kiddie abuser.

Post Author 2021-01-22 at 18:17

Paul writing to the Ephesians, Chapter 3 versus 9:15

And to make all men see what is the fellowship of the mystery, which from the beginning of the world hath been hid in God, who created all things by Jesus Christ:

John Chapter 1, verse 10

He was in the world, and the world was made by him, and the world knew him not.

John states the Trinitarian position pretty clearly.

King James translates “Logos” as “the word”, though we have no equivalent word in English. It means, in this context, the natural order, or the moral sense implied by the natural order, or the logic and purpose of the natural order, or …

Not readily translatable from the Greek without seven pages of Greek philosophy.

1. In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.

2 The same was in the beginning with God.

3 All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made.

4 In him was life; and the life was the light of men.

5 And the light shineth in darkness; and the darkness comprehended it not.

6 There was a man sent from God, whose name was John.

7 The same came for a witness, to bear witness of the Light, that all men through him might believe.

8 He was not that Light, but was sent to bear witness of that Light.

9 That was the true Light, which lighteth every man that cometh into the world.

10 He was in the world, and the world was made by him, and the world knew him not.

11 He came unto his own, and his own received him not.

Joe

2021-01-23 at 10:00

We get an even more explicit declaration of the existence of the trinity if we combine John 1:14 with 1 John 5:7.

John 1:14

And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth.

1 John 5:7

For there are three that bear record in heaven, the Father, the Word, and the Holy Ghost: and these three are one.

So Jesus Christ is the Word made flesh, and those three that are one are the Father, the Word, and the Holy Ghost.

Dave

2021-01-22 at 16:37

“For example, your real estate agent can argue that you are pricing the house you are selling too high, it will not clear the market.”

He’s pushing you to cut the price so the house will sell faster. He’ll get a slightly smaller commission, but he’ll get it right away. His interests are not aligned with yours because he has many houses to sell, whereas you have only one.

https://www.zerothposition.com/2020/09/14/colonize-bookshelf-part-iv/

2021-01-22 at 17:34

Good point. And reinforces my essential point, you don’t even do rational argumentation with your agent. You do it with a reliable, good, honest friend telling you “at that price it will take forever to sell”

Lord

2021-01-21 at 08:01

Top article all around. Especially for pointing how Hitler and Co. were not just failures but also deviated from actual tradition:

“We still want and need freedom. This is who we are and who we will always be, which is why the National Socialists undermining the traditional family structure and erasing local allegiances was so self-defeating. And yet as seen in their impeccable aesthetics, they had good instincts, and never better than in trying to revive the Aryan spirit through their own Germanic idiom. We can say the same about Filmer in considering the polity as an extension of the family: this is how it worked for millennia for our ancestors, and indeed, is the only way it can work for us. We can say the same about Maistreâ€™s instincts, prizing as he did the unwritten constitution, the altar erected by the work of circumstances, the tradition hallowed by its antiquity, the rites made sacred by the impersonal, imperative utterance of the ancestral deity, the truest expression of fas.

On the surface, all of these things seem radically different, and seem to bear no relation to â€œthe Rightâ€ that holds liberty and the individual as self-evident goods in themselves. But scratch the surface, dig deeperâ€”all the way to the rootâ€”colonize the deep past, and one finds that what is now many was originally one: we find that the weak, separate rods were once bound into a mighty fascis. The absolutism of Filmer, the traditionalism of Maistre, the radical corporatism of the Third Reich, were once united in the person of the Aryan House Father, standing astride his dominion, exercising his unimpeachable will, and seeing above it none but the line of fathers in his family sepulchre, those fathers who animate his very being, who form the unbreakable chain of which he is but a link, and whom he will one day join in the hereafter. What is now broken was once unbroken, and if any hope remains to us in this world of broken families, splintered religion, and failed states, it will look at least in outline like what has sustained us in some form or another for six millennia from the time when all the now scattered branches of the Aryan family dwelt together in Central Asia.”

Big Brutha

2021-01-21 at 10:33

It’s been a sad couple of days. This could have ended so differently if DJT had overcome his normalcy bias. Alas. It’s been doubly sad to see someone like Vox Day, who I know is not everyone’s cup of tea, seemingly lose touch with reality. Lesson for all of us: don’t get high on your own supply. While there could be a lot of ways to interpret what was happening, the Qanon-way got further and further from reality the longer it went on. At some point, you have to get off the merry-go-round, and ground your observations in what’s actually happening. He reminds me of the wide-eyed folks I used to meet in the Middle East whose theories of political skullduggery got weirder and weirder over time. I get that conspiracies happen and I am not saying they don’t. But when your predictions and subsequent observations match up less and less often it’s time to re-evaluate your models. It’s the Right-wing version of “Climate science.”

S.J., Esquire

2021-01-21 at 12:58

Yeah, idk man. I said this on another forum recently, it was never about “Q”, not really – I only became interested in “Q” after it already looked like there was a lot of weird stuff going on. Which it still does look like.

In a way I feel freer today.

Javier

2021-01-21 at 14:17

Vox had just become embarrassing and sad. Hard to respect anything someone says when they are that deluded.

jsd

2021-01-21 at 18:06

Look at him banning “gamma males” for saying things like:

“I beg you, after seventeen years, don’t jump off this cliff. You’re not a boomer, you don’t need to commit intellectual suicide. No one is ever going to listen to you again, except boomers.”

“What is wrong with you, Vox. These guys look to you for rational analysis and commentary and all you give them is false hope based on nothing. You’ve been wrong all along the way for weeks now. Yet you keep it up. Don’t keep fooling these people. Tell the the truth.”

“A bunch of NG drafted in from mainly blue states is not part of some Trump 11th hour storm you clowns. It’s over, Trump is a civnat boomer with a gonzo mouth and some comic timing.”

Sure looks like he is “doubling down.” Something has always been wrong with him. Maybe just that he bit off more than he can chew, trying to act up to his role as a leader-soothsayer. When people look to you it is enticing to pretend to know more than you do and to act up to their expectations. He overextended himself and now his shadow “gamma” characteristics are coming out.

ERTZ

2021-01-21 at 18:58

I find it weird how serious talk here was about a replay of ancient Rome,
though while human nature is rather constant and learning of history is important to prevent making the same mistakes again,
the modern environment and conditions are quite different, very new effects and circumstances must be considered, that make a replay unlikely(almost autistic in its form:I imagined boys with tin figures of Caesar, Brutus, etc. with glued on paper faces of Trump etc. playing in the sand (=interpreting news media events with their current ideology);

how Trump has been glorified as a Messiah-like figure, half-God-like “emperor”, while evidently being just a less-successful grifter with pathetic involvement in plebs TV, zero track record of learning and intellectual pursuits – he even made his school grades a secret by law, which speaks much of itself, if only of his insecure personality;

the talk here about how the US military factions in a civil war might nuke the US homeland, talk of nuclear submarine commanders taking sides etc. …
there was a lot of reality loss going on here.

As an outsider I find it interesting how similar left and right are in many aspects:

Both talk a lot of how the other side is going to kill them, are citing much historic evidence of the fact and make plans/fantasies to defend themselves or counter-attack.
Both produce copious amounts of texts of questionable quality, which is regarded as a secret, or at least not-understood-by-most, deep, unquestionable and uniting truth.
Both flock together around charismatic leaders, which are highly intelligent, well-read and deeply knowledgeable-and correct in many aspects, therefore respected as leaders by many, but critically flawed in at least one point of their taught ideology (say, Chomsky on the left, Jim or Moldbug here)-humans can be (at least partially, it’s called “cognitive blind spot”) crazy and wrong, despite being highly intelligent and knowledgeable.
Both talk and think of a great, far-reaching, secret, powerful conspiracy of the other side, very dangerous and the “real enemy” to be fought – visible and invisible,
everything that happens is interpreted, fantasized to produce more and more complex explanations for its existence and evil workings, in a hopeless
attempt to keep ideology fitting to real events, producing ever more complex and extreme rationalizations and predictions.
Both desire violent revolution, secret or overt, to come to power and force their “absolutely true” ideas on everybody else, desiring to shape society in totalitarian fashion.

Much of the left-right ideology’s extremes make me think of a cult, with all the underlying cult psychology,
for example an UFO cult (world ends soon, aliens will rescue us true believers):
They may begin sane, with social benefits (social psychology, reward system activation by having allies/friends/being accepted , then feeling superior from occult/superior knowledge, then enjoying rewards from personal identity and sense of belonging by defining outsiders as enemies etc.), joint activities.

Then there’s “sunk cost fallacy”, analog to an inferior, low quality tool that one made oneself, spent a long time creating it, therefore never replacing it for a superior tool made by a factory for just a few cents to buy – suffering along working inefficiently with an inferior tool, because of that irrationality – and the same is true of ideas, ideas that one loves and is invested in, because one wants them to be true, because one has created them oneself, refined and improved on the ideas oneself in long hard work, with much thinking and reading, so the idea has become like one’s child;
and then “social proof”, because many others were being told of the idea/belief system, and if it would be exposed as (partially) wrong, then there would not be just private insult of one’s intelligence and efforts, one also would suffer social embarrassment, loss of social status, loss of being seen by others as a near-perfect intellectual (leader),public proof of having been wrong.
So instead of correcting oneself, admitting being wrong, the ideology is being kept, while attempts are made to bend reality around the idea/ideology – necessitating ever-increasing loss of contact with reality (“crazy”) and requirement for more and more extreme interpretations and predictions – until the whole bubble pops.

Just because many here are indeed right on women it does not follow that much of the other ideas are also mostly true.

See, I am quite stupid. I have proof of it, I made many mistakes, I believed many wrong things. So I may be, most probably about many things must be, wrong.
But I desire truth most, and I have corrected myself very often, letting go of old beliefs, even if that meant painful loss of dear illusions or acquiring uncomfortable new world models. So far it has served me very well; and I have found that many people are unwilling or unable to do this to themselves – their worldview and idealogies,
their desires what is true, what they want to be true, are not updated by themselves, they just die with them, and are thus updated by “gnon”.

Here’s my interpretation of events:

Republicans and Democrats are much the same, at least at the top, both are right-wing parties serving the interests of the upper class.
They just playact right and left, to give the people what they need, an “other side”, an opponent;
naturally, there are winners and losers, those being or aspiring to be strong, and those who want to be soft and kind, and both parties just service those human psychological needs accordingly. Voting is only meaningful for politicians, because it determines how much money and reproductive success they will have.
Voters effectively only vote on the size of politicians’ (and their staff’s) future mansions and quantity+quality of their wives, not on policy;
because policy is a stable factor outside voters’ whims, namely the interest of the upper class, “national interest”, effectively the US’ top 500 families or so.
And in accordance with that interpretation, neither Clinton, Obama nor Trump were able to affect anything meaningful – no deep, non-superficial changes to the system.
But a lot of noise, meaningless, utterly meaningless, hysterical political actions, Antifa here, riots there, a lot of wind in the media – and in the end, nothing that even remotely changed long-term development, nothing that made a lasting difference.
To provoke, tease and annoy, psychological outrage-inducers are identified and then employed, under wide media coverage, to cause the desired major outrage,
political diversion and attention/ad clicks – left and right are played against each other like pawns.
In all that apparent chaos the upper class’ rule and profits, the economy, work and consumption quietly go on, are what remains stable.
Women will work, men will work, transsexuals will work, immigrants will be immigrating and work, but all will work for or exist for the upper class’ profit.
While everybody else is kept squabbling, through careful psychological and political operations, to keep everybody else but the upper class on their knees.
The only reason why other people should be allowed to exist is to profit from them, make them useful for oneself; if they’re not, then they’re either useless or dangerous.
Making other people work to profit from their work, directly or indirectly, is the only rational reason I see why other people should be kept around.
And exactly that is happening, the US, and more and more the rest of the world, is becoming a work-maximization operation for the benefit of the upper class (but evidently also for everybody else). The rest is smoke and mirrors, entertainment.

Was the election stolen from Trump?
Perhaps, but it doesn’t matter, he never truly ruled, the top 500 or so families (their members dealing with ruling) always do. It’s them who are forming the real electorate that makes the big decisions. Trump was merely in their way, an accident, a disappointment, a hindrance, an inconvenience.

Post Author 2021-01-21 at 19:24

> the modern environment and conditions are quite different, very new effects and circumstances must be considered,

We have been around this merry go round many times, many times, before.

Rome is the archetypical failure of the Republic caused by the decline in elite virtue. All the way to the late nineteenth century, people recognized that story as replaying over and over.

Israel of the time of Jesus is archetypical holiness spiral, and that story, which is right now our biggest problem, has also replayed over and over.

The French assignat is the archetypical failure of fiat money.

Nothing that matters has changed in social technology, other than double entry accounting and corporate form that it made possible.

I rather expect that the blockchain and triple entry cryptographically signed accounting will also make an advance in social technology possible, changes that the ICO prefigures, but right now our problems are with social technology that has not advanced since the time of Greece and Rome.

We need to reboot systems that are very old, and have been broken. At the same time, while waiting for the conditions that will make a reboot possible, we need to work on the social technologies of the future. Which is corporations as sidechains on the blockchain, for these technologies will make it possible to preserve truth, technology, and the market economic order through what may be well be a very long dark age.

Post Author 2021-01-21 at 19:48

> the talk here about how the US military factions in a civil war might nuke the US homeland, talk of nuclear submarine commanders taking sides etc. â€¦
> there was a lot of reality loss going on here.

You are suffering from normalcy bias. Normal died a long time ago, and people are failing to realize it.

This happens every time – the social order collapses, and people continue to act as if it was still in effect. Caesar died of this, and Trump may well die of it. The elites died of it in the Russian and French Revolutions. They thought they were moving to a constitutional monarchy, and the elites went with Biden, because they figure that they will rule with the president as mere figurehead, as the elites in the Russian and French revolutions thought they could rule with the sovereign as a mere figurehead, but without a leader, they are going to be helpless against their dangerously useful allies, the radical left.

The old fight with the Arians is still going strong, with most modern bibles issued by Socinians, hence the King James conflict, between bibles in which God created the world through Jesus Christ and Old Testament Hebrews had the patriarchal social order and kept female sexuality under control, and bibles where Jesus is only a regular mortal, and the Hebrews totally accepted the nineteenth century position on female sexuality.

The dispute about which Bible edition to use is the old conflict with the Arians, still going strong, and indissolubly linked to the attack on the family, the family being the current big applecart that the left is busy knocking over, which is indissolubly linked to the issue of faggots in the military and women on the front line, which is indissolubly linked to the issue of who controls the praetorian guard now in Washington.

We are still fighting this fourth century battle, and the action about which bible to use is going down in Washington as we speak. When they interview the guy in charge of the National guard in Washington, it is part of the fourth century conflict over Christology.

clovis

2021-01-22 at 07:54

I’m not following the leap from politics into theology here. Most modern bible translations, afaik, still say women will have pain in childbearing and they will be ruled over by their husbands. The problem isn’t the translation but the teaching in the churches and the failure of people to read the bibles. Also not following how this is related to Arianism, or how the National Guard general is discussing Christology. Can you explain because I’m slow apparently thx

Post Author 2021-01-22 at 08:12

> Iâ€™m not following the leap from politics into theology here

The bible that deletes the reference to God creating the world through Jesus Christ, will add a reference to “marriageable age”.

> or how the National Guard general is discussing Christology.

The National Guard General is not discussing Christology.

But the Socinian Christology has Christ changing the moral rules for the better, rather than calling the Jews back to the eternal and unchanging spirit of the law, which is a basis for continuing to change them for the better. And a lot of troops do not think they are changing for the better, but for the worse. And so, Democrats want to make sure that troops and officers in DC do think that moral rules are being changed for the better.

calov

2021-01-22 at 16:31

Thanks, makes sense now.

(not)RedBible

2021-01-22 at 12:42

Don’t you know, that when women being under the rule of men was a result of a fallen state, and that since Christ the fall has been revoked, women are free from the “oppressive” chains of men’s sin.

Also Jesus totally thought women were better than men, since he had TWO women followers. (Pay no attention to the 12 apostles.)

Also Jesus taught a Higher Law ™ so the entire lower Law of Moses doesn’t apply, you bigot. (Never mind that the Higher Law ™ seem much easier to follow since boyfriend Jesus will always forgive me for being a whore.) (Also ignore all of the apostles taking about the Law in a way that clearly references the Law of Moses.)

Certain verses don’t need rewriting by the progressives since the “context” has already been rewritten by them.

For example, when Jesus Christ talks about “lusting after a woman” they love ignoring two things that the Greek text clearly shows. First is that the word being translated as “Lust” here is translated everywhere else in the NT as Covet. Second is that the word for “Woman” here in Greek is basically always used for “a man’s woman” a.k.a. “a man’s wife.”
so we apply these changes, and get a verse that reads
[blockquote]”But I say unto you, That whosoever looketh on another man’s woman to covet her hath committed adultery with her already in his heart.[/blockquote]
So rather than demonizing normal male sexuality for finding a women boner inducing, it re-adds sanity to the law by connecting the 10th commandment to the 7th.

Pseudo-chrysostom

2021-01-22 at 18:28

When sketching out exegesis, the best impact comes from actually including the words you are digging back into the etymology of. This is meant helpfully of course.

Prince Charming

2021-01-23 at 00:58

What shocks me is that when reading e.g. Roman politicians, or Paul’s epistles, is how matter-of-factly those people understood reality, whereas we seem to be flailing about in darkness.

Like, Plato wrote the parable of the cave when everyone he knew was redpilled on everything.

I don’t really know what to do about it?

Jehu

2021-01-22 at 17:53

Fun fact. Arius, the original Arian heretic, was punched out at the council of Nicea by Saint Nick. Yeah, that Saint Nick. We’ve done some skits and dramas at our church commemorating that glorious event.
Saint Nick, who is apparently in the category of ‘Brawler Saints’ was stripped of his bishop’s garb and thrown in prison for doing this, but apparently Jesus and his mom intervened, made him a new bishop garment, and prevailed on the Emperor to get him out of jail. And the argument was settled in Nick’s favor.
But Arius is like the master villain in a comic book. He just keeps coming back. The urge to demote our Lord and Master Jesus to a community organizer and become holier than him just keeps coming back.

The Cominator

2021-01-22 at 18:01

Don’t think Arius made Jesus a community organizer or even not divine. The Germanics for a long time followed the Arian version of Christianity… they as a warrior culture would have hated Jesus as community organizer.

He merely said the incarnation the son was a lesser manifestation of the greater God.

The Cominator

2021-01-21 at 19:53

“Republicans and Democrats are much the same, at least at the top, both are right-wing parties serving the interests of the upper class.”

Marxists class categories are fake and gay.

Bilge_Pump

2021-01-21 at 23:59

First off, I have to apologize if anyone has been replying to things I write. I don’t often have the time patience or interest to read direct responses to things I’ve said. Often the things other people talk about are more interesting than the topics I bring up.

That being said, what are the differences between Marxist class categories and based / red pilled / good class categories? Seems to me like the only difference is in the framing; where the Marxists would say “oppressed proles, righteous indignation”, the based would say ….? “righteously oppressed proles, but don’t tell them that”?

The Cominator

2021-01-22 at 00:06

Marxists class categories are based on your wealth, reactionary class categories are based on your occupation and roughly correspond to Hindu Varnas and they tend to strongly correlate with your political views. With the brahmin/priest class (lawyers, bureaucrats journalists, academics intellectuals and such) being the real enemy class.

Gestahlt

2021-01-22 at 12:07

All of NRX needs to get it through their heads: lawyers and scholars are not first caste, are not brahmins. They are vaisya, tradesmen. Intellect is not spirit.

2021-01-22 at 12:32

Just what is a Muslim cleric, if not a lawyer and legal scholar?

2021-01-22 at 16:30

@Gestahlt

Law and Study are different in their classical forms than modern. Classical scholars were certainly Brahmins, and “lawyers” did not exist because “laws” were simple and straightforward. Modern corruption is because “law” and “education” have become “professions” now, and their practitioners expect to get paid for their performance, which is a vaishya trait. This has happened in part because Anglo society is certainly extremely vaishya-dominated, or at least used to be (“nation of shopkeepers” indeed), so status is inextricably linked with money. Thus every Brahmin is forced to go against his duty, and worship at the altar of Mammon, and become a “professional” or perform “knowledge work,” which leads to the contradiction that you so correctly pointed out.

The Cominator

2021-01-22 at 17:44

I don’t agree I will not agree and NRx is not going to agree.

2021-01-22 at 18:02

There is something hilarious about Hindus educating us about our own culture and traditions. It is hard even for us to get it in this modern world. And yes, they as one of the great cultures of history, and perhaps less pozzed, might teach us something about human universals. But I really don’t think they can understand the specialties of White Christian culture better than us.

And I notice the pattern here. Overly undefined, nebulous approaches to “spirituality” is precisely what was the problem with Whites too much influenced by something like Hinduism, even when it was our own invention, like Hegelianism. We are a fairly precise and get-things-done kind of race. Our spirituality is very much a practical cookbook.

2021-01-22 at 19:24

@TheDividualist

There is something hilarious about Hindus educating us about our own culture and traditions.

I would not dare try to “educate” any of you fine folk here. I merely state my observations, and I have learned much from the discourse in this and other similar great places.

But I must state that most of my views and analyses clearly mark “Hindu” opinion (which you are free to ignore as irrelevant minutiae), and “Aryan” belief, which one is bound to consider.

The “caste system” is undoubtedly Aryan in origin, and I found it surprising at first that Moldbug used expressly Hindu terms to deal with it. But then I realised that Latin or Greek terms may have overloaded meanings in Western literature, and would not get his points across.

I also noted, with trepidation, and some small disappointment, that he, a Semite, had a better grasp of Aryan social technology than any contemporary Aryans. Maybe this is because of the brainwashing that Aryan children are subject to, I don’t know.

“White Christian culture” is a complex being. There is Aryan culture, which has adopted a Semitic god (Yahweh) but actually worships an Aryan-ified deity (Jesus) in a curiously Aryan (Trinitarian) and non-Semitic way. Churches which accept this and play their role in their national society prosper, while Maximalist Churches which seek global domination are subject to rampant entryism and destruction (Catholic/Evangelicals).

…spiritualism…

Is an anti-Christian, anti-God Leftist anti-concept as defined by hipster-Hindu Beatles and other crypto-Marxists. Hindus indulge in a lot of navel gazing, true, but that shit is just retarded. Think of it as a failure mode in the absence of a strong Imperial cult. When there is no strong single cult of the God-Imperator three thousand miles away, there will be a thousand cults three miles away.

I’ll probably have to expand my imaginary blog post on religion. 🙂

2021-01-22 at 16:18

@TheCominator and @BilgePump

Reactionary categories are not class categories at all, but rather caste categories. Class is something that rises and falls with individual labour and fortune. Caste is correlated with the nature of a man, which is mostly genetic. A Brahmin may shovel shit for an occupation (happens a lot), but still retains the seed of intellect, whereas you may polish up a Shudra and seat him at Harvard the Most Holy but he still remains a buffoon, which truth is revealed as soon as he starts speaking. That they correspond with Hindu varnas is because Varnasharm is merely the description of human nature. Any truthful study of humanity will reach similar conclusions. The caste “system” is not really a “system” at all, any more than “chemical naming system” is a system. This was one of Moldbug’s great insights for the Western mind.

Why is this important? Because if one knows one’s nature and is at peace with it, it becomes easier to achieve material success and spiritual happiness in life, and a contented death, which is what everyone ultimately wants.

Dharmicreality

2021-01-22 at 17:14

This is something that I find hard to explain to the Western mind as well and youâ€™ve put it succinctly. Classes are different from caste. A Brahmin in India can absolutely be low class in terms of lifestyle, wealth and hierarchy in the power structure which is actually a reality in India today. Observe how our temple priests find it hard to even eke out a living from their duties and live a life of poverty. Even the relatively well off Brahmins are still middle class. In fact most of the ruling elite in India are not Brahmins at all.

With some exceptions literal Brahmins are actually far from power or prestige in India and have been for a long time, and more recently because of our very own â€œaffirmative actionâ€ reservation quota system.

Epstein's Suicide Note

2021-01-21 at 20:39

The “top 500” is correct in a sense, but it is not top 500 by wealth, as you imply and no doubt want readers to infer. It’s top 500 by social status and political connections. That includes the Clinton family near the top, the Biden family near the bottom, and many families no one has ever heard of in between.

Progressives are a social class, not an economic one. It’s a group of mostly upper-middle-class whites and a small number of the very wealthy waging war against the majority of the very wealthy and almost all of the lower middle class, using the underclasses as a proxy. In a nutshell, it’s SWPLs vs. Old Money and Amerikaners, and it’s quite possibly the longest-running and most one-sided war ever fought in history.

Everybody here understands HLvM by now, only shills deny it. But the “high” is not the wealthy, the “high” is (and always has been) the rulers and the politically powerful. In the old aristocracies, that went hand-in-hand with wealth and capital, and things were better back then. We don’t live in an age of aristocracies anymore, unless you consider bioleninism a form of aristocratic privilege.

https://www.cnn.com/2020/10/23/us/plane-crash-alabama-trnd/index.html

2021-01-22 at 16:33

…unless you consider bioleninism a form of aristocratic privilege.

Kakistocratic privilege, perhaps?

onyomi

2021-01-22 at 01:16

Thinking about Trump’s shortcomings and Q recently I realized that Q, whatever the motivations for its creation, was so successful worming its way into many brains because it so perfectly filled an explanatory “slot” left by an odd aspect of Trump’s behavior.

Trump sees the problems (overreacting to covid, antifa violence, critical race theory, mail-in ballots, big tech censorship), he loudly complains about the problems, he’s the POTUS and seems like a bold, energetic guy… yet mysteriously nothing gets done about any of the problems, seemingly even those he unambiguously could do something about even without institutional support.

Q steps into that explanatory gap by saying, “The POTUS is not weirdly inactive/all talk and/or completely lacking any support whatsoever from anyone in the whole government, there’s merely a lot of stuff going on behind the scenes. He sees the problems, he knows the problems, do you really think he’s just sitting back and doing nothing??”

Of course, it’s not actually the simplest explanation, which is generally that things are as they seem and people are myopic, polyannaish, backstabby, etc., but it was an explanation that explained the strange observed reality fairly well for many.

Anonymous 2

2021-01-22 at 08:27

The most interesting part was that the whole unmoored Qanon thing still got banned in unison by the forces of progress, presumably because it provided an effective rallying point.

Well, that and Epstein didn’t kill himself.

Epstein's Suicide Note

2021-01-22 at 15:55

Qanon was a foil for the left, not unlike late-stage KKK and Buckley’s entire Conservative movement, and foils eventually have to be defeated for good. People get bored of watching the hero fight the same villain over and over again. Once those anons, and many not-so-anons, outlived their usefulness, it was time to get rid of them.

f6187

2021-01-21 at 17:16

@R7 “Endless wall-of-text vs an actual livestream.”

God bless. Here, let me duckduckgo that for you:

https://news.usni.org/2020/10/23/2-killed-in-navy-t-6b-texan-ii-trainer-crash-in-alabama

There’s probably more out there, since I get the distinct impression that the U.S. military is pozzed A.F., despite what the Flash Gordon crew are doing out there on the marsh.

Ace

2021-01-22 at 18:48

I still remember the first female navy aviator “qualified” for carrier landings. She locked up during a landing destroying her F14, killing herself, and almost killing her radar operator who pulled the ejection at the last second to save himself. Since then I’ve read about women being promoted to squadron leader on carriers but it’s not entirely clear if they do any actual landings themselves. Computerization probably helps in that area.

Soon they’ll be in charge of super carriers:
https://www.military.com/daily-news/2018/03/09/could-be-first-female-carrier-co-history.html

The Chinese won’t need to sink them. They’ll crash into their escorts and sink the first time they’re under attack.

Catholic Sheepdog

2021-01-23 at 00:47

I read over 20 years ago a comment somewhere that with the way things are going in the west, that it will end up being the case that Russia will end up being able to defeat the US & Europe is a war.

I don’t think they saw that women crashing aircraft carriers into their cruiser escorts would be the reason why though xDD

Mister Grumpus

2021-01-22 at 05:42

So there goes plan-trusting, and I don’t just mean in Trump, White Hats and Qanon. There goes plan-trusting in elections, or the government, or the Constitution, or the law, or the Road to Roota, or whatever.

OK maybe I’ll switch to plan-trusting that the Air Force’s nukes don’t work anymore so that Putin can pull something out over there. Tempting.

Come to think of it, I must still be plan-trusting around the whole “Western” Westphalian nation-state thing, like in general. I’m still seeing puffs of smoke there where the Road Runner left hours ago. I really need to catch up.

This Globo-Harvard-Google-Twitter-Equalism thing is just too damn strong. There’s no Presidential Pardon for being called racist on the internet.

Moldbug observed that the Eye of Sauron only turns to things that it can influence. People it can status-threaten into “leaking power” its way. Maybe the Meme War would still be raging if Twitter were run by some mysterious Tyler Durden figure on the far side of the Moon with all the food and women he needed.

Let’s notice that bitcoin, while imperfect, is doing so well now because it was explicitly written to be uncontrollable. That’s new! There’s no bitcoin ban hammer, so there’s no one for Teen Vogue to threaten to use it on someone or else.

And there we have it. Crypto-warriors for the win, please, I beg you. It’ll be Samizdat all over again. The Cathedral collapse murder orgy grows ever more self-evident, but people will be too afraid to see it for themselves unless there’s a safe (if virtual) place where someone can tell them that yes, they see it too, so there’s at least two of us.

And crucially, what we’ve learned here is that Redpill Questions can be used to filter out shills. Redpill Questions are the killer app for this new crypto-societal technology.

Post Author 2021-01-22 at 05:56

The great vulnerability of bitcoin is the blood diamonds attack. There is no ban hammer, but there could be. Fortunately our enemies don’t comprehend the technology well enough to mount the attack.

Mister Grumpus

2021-01-22 at 06:35

And thatâ€™s exactly it. The South American superkings couldnâ€™t comprehend guns, germs or steel either.

Also notice that a lot of big shots are deciding that â€œIf they canâ€™t beat them then join themâ€ wrt cryptocurrency. Goldman Sachs needs to hang onto something through The Purges just as much as I do.

What Iâ€™m trying to say is that itâ€™s not just Internet Frog People who need crypto-society. Thereâ€™s already intense demand from the upper tiers as well. No one has told me this, Iâ€™m just asserting it out of my own perceptions, but Iâ€™ll bet you a pocket full of Satoshis anyway.

There are people in the FBI, and Wall Street, and etc, right now, who can already smell the crocodiles around the corner. They know they need to start conspiring with their trusted fraternity buddies to GTFO in some shape or form, even though they donâ€™t consciously get it yet. Fear is a survival instinct that functions well below the intellect.

The Ducking Man

2021-01-22 at 13:58

I live in south-east asia country where transacting Bitcoin is punishable 5 years jail time. Some people actually went to jail during the first bitcoin boom few years ago for selling bitcoin.

I’m not fluent on the technicalities how they can be tracked down, I guess everything is possible if ISP is selling out to government.

I plan-trust lots of thing but bitcoin is not one of them.

2021-01-22 at 16:02

Bitcoin is 100% trackable and has zero privacy. Also, using BTC in Asia is like painting a huge target on your back for “the authorities.” BTC has a lot of traction in India but it is still in a legal grey area (used to be illegal but Supreme Court found the rule to be unconstitutional). We can actually buy and (theoretically) hodl it now, but it is worse than cash.

Ace

2021-01-22 at 18:32

So there goes plan-trusting, and I donâ€™t just mean in Trump, White Hats and Qanon. There goes plan-trusting in elections, or the government, or the Constitution, or the law, or the Road to Roota, or whatever.

Trump had a legal plan, but it was rooted in normality & the Republic and normality & the Republic are quite dead. Making plans for the future is unlikely to work as the pace of social entropy increases ever faster.

RedBible

2021-01-22 at 12:12

Yesterday I was thinking to myself: There a real possibility that a group on the left is going to start pushing “pedophilia” since it’s one of the few remaining “minorities” that get clear and obvious hate. (Yes pedophilia is an anti-concept, but it is the way that the left will push it.)

I’m still not sure how it is supposed to lead to knocking over apple carts, but seeing how apparently yesterday twitter refused to remove CP (of a 13 year old girl) because it “didn’t violate there terms of service” I’d say that my hunch seems on point, especially since it appears (based on what I’ve seen) Law Enforcement isn’t getting involve so far.

That said, my personal guess if that before 2024 “pedophilia” will be legal. Now, I have no clue if it will be only the gay shit, or if it will include normal sex, but I’m pretty sure that “pedo marriage” will not be legal.

(A few years ago there were some lefties pushing that kids should be allowed to refuse hugs/kisses from relatives because of the principles of “consent”, so this is really just the natural result of a holiness spiral at work.)

Anonymous Fake

2021-01-22 at 12:25

[*deleted because unresponsive*]

Time for a second Dissolution of the Monasteries

Post Author 2021-01-23 at 03:23

We already had this argument

And you instead of responding to what was said are just repeating yourself yet again.

2021-01-22 at 12:31

That would be an interesting shitshow to watch, because the gays are pushing for having the right to fuck young boys, while the post-wall retired-carousel-rider feminists are pushing against men having the right to fuck women younger than themselves, as then they really have no chance. Indeed a gay-only outcome is expectable, but how can they even spin that, saying that a 14 years old boy is capable of informed consent and a 17 years old girl is not, would imply things they really don’t want to imply.

OTOH willingness to break the law is an obvious alpha indicator. They could basically just make heterosex illegal, and any man unwilling to break that law would be not alpha enough to be interesting to women anyway. THAT is why patriarchical i.e. real marriage is illegal. It is a shit test, wives are happy to submit to husbands who are willing to dominate them illegally, because that is an alpha indicator.

The Ducking Man

2021-01-22 at 13:47

One brief narrative I’ve read is “pedophilia is genentic” basically certain people are more inclined by their genetic to pursue much younger “partner”. It works to push gay agenda, so I don’t see why not.

Most likely via bogus research to prove “it’s genetic”.

Another way I can see is society is being conditioned to pursue sex as ultimate purpose in life. Without restrain significant portion of male will starts chasing girls during their peak period which is 12 to 14 years old.

Pseudo-Chrysostom

2021-01-22 at 14:42

In this matter, the general insecure desire for control, power, or impact, that commonly facilitates leftisms, expressed here through transgressing norms but for the fact that they are norms, is at odds with the feminist tendency that is served by removing the possibility of wedlock through inflating ‘age of consent’ to infinity, by creating a leverage of power that can be invoked by a woman over a man in any interactions between the same through the same (‘statutory rape’), by presupposing a frame where such a thing as a ‘consent age’ could be a thing in the first place, and the bugman tendency to de-sex/de-vivify/denature people in general, also through inflating ‘aoc’ to infinity.

Obviously there will be no consistency in any of it, and conflict between vagarious leftist clades is the rule. The most reliable watermark you can use in these matters is, whether or not it can be used as a weapon against more competent targets. Eg, what would hurt straits, or whites, or males (or even strait white males) here the most? This is why, for example, expanding the franchise to aliens is a big ticket, but further logical expansions to say, donkeys, aren’t; because our humble burros are not a politically useful element in the way the formers are, so what’s the incentive? Certainly not formal rigor.

Anonymous 2

2021-01-22 at 15:39

apparently yesterday twitter refused to remove CP (of a 13 year old girl) because it â€œdidnâ€™t violate there terms of serviceâ€

One could also report Twitter to the police for this and see what happens.

Ace

2021-01-22 at 18:30

It was a 13 year boy. Sex with young boys is unofficially legal now and CPS officers are getting rich selling young boys as sex slaves to fags.

onyomi

2021-01-23 at 01:12

Oh good, so they’ll uncancel Milo Yiannopoulos?

Encelad

2021-01-22 at 15:09

“Am donating $100M towards a prize for best carbon capture technology”

-Elon Musk on Twitter

I smell fear… Is he trying to appease our new masters with indulgences?

2021-01-22 at 15:27

No, this is clever. We are powerless to stop the madness. The clever thing is to sow discord between our enemies. We also know globalwarming is just an excuse to do evil. So the clever thing is to call the bluff.

Capturing carbon and turning it into fuel is what a tree does, inventing a more efficient tree is generally not a terrible idea.

It would be better to do nothing, but making a better tree is far less bad than all the alternatives. It splits those who really seriously believe in globalwarming, they will support it, from those who just want to use it as an excuse to do evil, who will not.

Epstein's Suicide Note

2021-01-22 at 15:50

Don’t be gay. Elon Musk has a long history of sucking up to the green movement and really anyone in power. It’s not fear, and it’s definitely not some brilliant strategy to weaken the enemy ranks. It’s just what he does and what he’s always done.

I can’t believe that new Secret Plan narratives are already emerging mere days after Qanon so spectacularly crashed and burned. People really never change.

Ace

2021-01-22 at 18:27

I canâ€™t believe that new Secret Plan narratives are already emerging mere days after Qanon so spectacularly crashed and burned. People really never change.

This sort of stuff is really common with doomsday cults. The day of doom comes and nothing happens. So they create a new doomsday and continue. They tend to shed followers every time this happens but the people who remain become even more dedicated and zealous about it. Sunk cost fallacy all the way to the bottom.

Theshadowedknight

2021-01-22 at 18:59

Yeah, but he changed during Trump’s term. We call him the Star Prophet because of that change. Now, he still needs to be circumspect, but I really do believe he wants to go to Mars. That drives him, and the rest is whatever he needs to do to that end. The reason he wants to go to Mars is something only he and God knows, but that is his purpose.

It’s not some secret plan to bring down the left. It’s him muttering pieties to get them off of his back while he continues his work. Whether it works or not depends on a lot of things. The worst case is that, “the revolution has no need of space explorers.” If it puts off any cost into the future and makes the donation contingent on performance, so much the better.

Post Author 2021-01-22 at 18:03

He has always been afraid, and always been trying to appease our masters.

The Cominator

2021-01-22 at 18:18

TheDividualist is right though. Musk is very very clever about doing it though… especially since Tesla collects way more than this every year in green subsidies.

Ace

2021-01-22 at 18:50

Carbon capture appears to be a viable tech now. The left hates it and doesn’t want it funded, but if it gets funded and built, it’s going to hurt their ability to wreak the industrial economy.

Ace

2021-01-22 at 19:33

Jim, why did you get Bob Barr so wrong? In retrospective it’s clear he was always a traitor. Someone slipped in to put the knife in Trump’s back when the the left needed it.

Pseudo-chrysostom

2021-01-22 at 20:49

A lot of people wanted to give Barr the benefit of the doubt; relative to the general trend of no swamp dwellers coming even close to acting in the interest of Trump in particular, and Amerikaners in general, even the least of cooperations can look like a ray of sunshine.

Friendly Fedposter

2021-01-22 at 22:52

Barr? Seriously? You guys still haven’t caught on yet.

And the Elon Musk offer being something more than face value is just more Q-level nonsense. Just a tax write-off. Don’t read into it.